Feminine archetypes?
Feb. 20th, 2007 05:15 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
poltr1In an earlier post, I talked about the Jungian masculine archetypes -- lover, warrior, magician, king. I'd imagine that they could map over to their feminine counterparts -- lover, warrior, magician, queen.
I've been trying to wrap my brain around how they'd map into maiden, warrior, mother, crone -- which I remember hearing from a song. (It was probably a filk song. That was the last line of the chorus. Can someone name that tune?)
Or maybe there's a different set of archetypes altogether, one that I have no knowledge of or exposure to.
And it's quite possible that I just can't comprehend this because I have a Y chromosome, among other things. :-P
I've been trying to wrap my brain around how they'd map into maiden, warrior, mother, crone -- which I remember hearing from a song. (It was probably a filk song. That was the last line of the chorus. Can someone name that tune?)
Or maybe there's a different set of archetypes altogether, one that I have no knowledge of or exposure to.
And it's quite possible that I just can't comprehend this because I have a Y chromosome, among other things. :-P
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Date: 2007-02-20 10:26 pm (UTC)I believe it's a Lackey/Fish
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Date: 2007-02-20 11:52 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-02-20 11:55 pm (UTC)Just as aspects of the phases of a woman may bleed over into others so may aspects of the man. A female may be a very motherly maiden, a mother may be rather crone like in her wisdom. So it often is with a male, Hunter and warrior often get blurred, but the wisdom age so often brings is always needed, respected and passed along to those who will learn.
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Date: 2007-02-21 12:14 am (UTC)If you consider the tarot each card of the Major Arcana represents one of the archetypes. Some of them have male-female counterparts and some do not. But if you think about everything in the universe needing to be balanced to be whole, then they contain those archetypes in some form (Jungian "shadow") whether or not they appear or are depicted. That's why the meaning of the card changes when it is upside-down, right?
In my trad, loose-knit as it is, we have maiden lover mother crone. But in every woman all four are present at one time. I guess you would call the lover the huntress as well...
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Date: 2007-02-21 02:13 am (UTC)Can I suggest some Campell here?
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Date: 2007-02-21 02:19 am (UTC)***Blink***
Date: 2007-02-21 02:45 am (UTC)No poking the hormonal chick with a sharp stick?
Re: ***Blink***
Date: 2007-02-21 03:16 am (UTC)No sharp stick, but I have a leather flogger. >;-)
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Date: 2007-02-21 03:54 am (UTC)Princess is usually the one who needs rescuing, there are some self-image issues wrapped up in that one, too. However, Princess is also an endearing connection in Father-Daughter terms.
Queen is typically the pre-menapausal time between Mother and Crone (for the empty nester) but I would apply Queen between Maiden and Crone if one is childless (yes, women CAN be childless by choice or by circumstance and do deserve their own archetype - some might call this Warrior).
I would also add in Cosmic Mother for the time of life assessment between death and re-birth. This comes directly from the Kabbalistic Tree of Life - Binah, the 3rd Sephirah (also experienced on Tau, the path between Malkuth and Yesod).
Bouncing off Lover, Warrior, Magickian, King I would say Siren/Lover, Warrior/Queen, Priestess, Crone.
Re: ***Blink***
Date: 2007-02-21 04:50 am (UTC)First off, I would suggest getting Joseph Campell's original "Myth" series, perhaps on tape, it's good for a commute.
And secondly, Dad has the rest of my fershluggin Men's archetype library in his room and I can't get in there till morning (I'm thinking you don't want my old audio of Women Who Run With the Wildebeasts and such, cos that's in the garage somewhere). Bugger. But if he's done with it, I can loan it to you. Tells me it's BEEN 10 years since Archetypes and I've been studying...what??? Oh hell. The origins of Christian theology. In Latin, Greek, Aramaic, and Hebrew, emphasis on the origins of Apocalyptic thought. Also, the History of Early American Sprituality, including slave traditions, Quakers, and Mormons.
Don't ask.
The only one I still in my room is the one about Campell's archetypes as used in the "Sandman" series. Only useful if you've read a) a lot of Campell and b) a LOOOOT of Sandman.
But yeah, the Origin of Myth is a good place to start.
And heck, reading The Complete Sandman with a copy of Bullfinch's Mythology as a reference isn't bad either.
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Date: 2007-02-21 10:42 am (UTC)Re: ***Blink***
Date: 2007-02-21 04:09 pm (UTC)Sandman? As in Neil Gaiman? That's on my "maybe someday I'll get around to reading it" list, right next to Girl Genius.
Re: ***Blink***
Date: 2007-02-21 06:54 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-02-21 06:56 pm (UTC)Re: ***Blink***
Date: 2007-02-21 07:46 pm (UTC)Re: ***Blink***
Date: 2007-02-21 07:50 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-02-22 04:35 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-02-23 01:45 am (UTC)It's not like all Campells work is on PBS. And I'd hardly consider him a hack. Nor would I consider him the be-all, end-all. But he's a damn sight less offensive than Jung. And like Bullfinch's, it's a place to start.
Unless YOU'VE written something better.